Foam Insulation Added to Roof (5/09/09)

Now that the roof has been repaired, I thought adding one inch of Extruded Styrene Foam Board (Pink Board by Owens Corning) would be a long term benefit. I happened to have (6), 4x8' sheets of this material in my garage that were left over from an insulation job I did to my sailboat.



Adding an inch of this R-5 rated Foam board, increased the insulation quality of our motorhome's roof substantially. The Tioga comes with 1.5" of Dow Blue Board installed between the framing and sandwiched between the interior panels of the roof and the outer skin, under the rubber roofing material.

Besides raising the value of insulation, from R-7.5 to R-12 overall, a touch more is added with the extra layer of 1/4" (5mm)Luan 4x8' sheeting put over it. I felt this additional layer of foam and luan would also stiffen the roof substantially.

The edges of the old roof were framed out with one inch of wood material, bonded with H.D. Liquid Nails and coated deck screws.

NOTE: Heavy Duty Liquid Nails works fine on most materials but does not work with the extruded styrene foam boards; USE THE TUB SURROUND FORMULA OF THE PRODUCT!






The foam panels are cut while down on the ground, from measurements we took up on the roof.... usually correctly :) but not always.. then brought up to the roof for a final check and trimming. (As insulation there is no problem gluing in an extra piece here and there if a mistake is made at this point.)





The adhesive was applied in larger quantities than the factory used,(I'm using 4 tubes/panel). Then the foam is applied and pressed into position. It's then lifted out for 3 minutes to allow the adhesive to flash off a bit/as per directions on the tube and the customer support hotline.





Next of course is applying the foam sheet back into position and pressed down for final bonding.

Covering the Foam Board (5/25/09)

Now, after adding one inch of extra foam board insulation to the roof, I need to cover it with 1/4" (5mm) of luan wood sheeting. I was lucky enough to find it at my local Home Depot for $11.50 per 4' x 8' sheet and it was at least rated moisture resistant.




Since it's under the final Rubber Roofing Dicor product yet to be applied, I feel OK with this thin but smooth sheeting, for surfacing material. WHY? Well, because what I have added, is, an addition to, not a replacement of. Adding insulation and a minimal layer of framing addes a few pounds but much, in the way of insulation and believe me... I would not do this for insulation value UNLESS I already had the old roofing off and had this opportunity!




[No original wood is any better and probably has lesser glues, so this should be perfect.] I have read on other sites of using 3/8"-1/2" wood, but from what I can decifer, they are using that on larger rigs and for Primary Roofing. (I am Doubling this roof/sandwiching an EXTRA layer of Foam Board, and not just replacing the old damaged wood sheeting.)


So far these last steps are working out really nicely.


We squared out the aft roof,

rather than deal with the old rounded edge that was certainly a culprit for leaks, as it would be difficult for a mfgr., owner or re-builder to seal the seams here with any certainty of success.



Straight corners/edges make things somewhat easier to work with and that seems to be where the newer Motor Homes have gone to within their designs...so; I will also!


Having added One Inch of material to the roof,
the Front Edge adds a bit of a challenge. I'm zero-ing in on this, with some extra effort to make a smooth flowing, extremely well sealed edge. NOTHING will leak HERE! This, I guarantee will last longer than anything on this rig. Of course, more to come, but for now, you see I'm dealing with a One Inch added height and it's squared off.. more later.

***THIS IS ADDITIONAL INFORMATION.

ADDED- 30 DEC. 2010:

To explain better the techniques I used to "Finish" this front edge of added Roofing Material.

Dicor Rubber Roofing material added first, then....

See "Drawing" below.

By the way....I forgot to include in the drawing that the Wood is attached to the Aluminum angle with 3M 5200 Adhesive sealant.

Dicor Roofing installation (6/05/09)

We have finally reached the point where we can unroll the Dicor Rubber Roofing material on top of our rig and prepare for gluing it down.

The additional extruded styrene foam board by Owens Corning has been glued in place between 1" wood framing.


The aft corner has been squared off.





Edges of the wood, have been sanded with a disc orbital sander to add a bit of a soft curve. All screw heads have been checked to make sure there is nothing sticking up that could damage the new material.




The water based Dicor glue was rolled on to the roof with a short nap roller, then the rubber was rolled forward and then aft, one section at a time, as per directions that come with the material.

----------------------------------------------

All went smoothly, however since there is a recommended Spread Rate, I'm going to make a recommendation that I did not follow, but should have. One Gallon should cover 200 sq.ft. I estimated I had to spread the glue over 160 sq. ft. (20x8') so I should have marked the roof in say.. Five foot sections and poured a bit less than a quart of glue into 4 disposable buckets. Starting at the front, I could have Spread the Glue quite precisely. Instead, I rolled it on to what looked correct, but was less than the suggested rate. I ended up with more glue than I wanted to. Everything looks good and seemed to work and I'm sure the company allows for variances in Spread Rate, but I would have been more comfortable KNOWING, I was spot on! So for your benefit, measure and apply CAREFULLY for the best application.
----------------------------------

The outer edges of the roof had been built up by one inch of added wood; just enough to contain extruded polystyrene insulation. This was then covered with a 1/4" of luan wood and later coated with the same glue and one side at a time. A day after the flat horizontal roof surface was glued down, the edges...of the Rubber Roofing material was gently drawn down for final adhesion.

Since we were REDOING an older roof, I wanted to re-use the original screw holes in the side of the motorhome for re-installing the aluminum track/molding. To do this accurately, we had marked with a pencil, the old screw holes in the side of the motorhome from the aluminum track around the upper edges. When we lifted this rail back into position, we used duct tape to hold up one end after a tiny and thin screw driver was inserted through ONE screw hole/ on one end /for alignment. The other end was held up by my wife while i aligned the center. Once the center was held level with an ice pick, into one of the holes(Pre-marked), I inserted a #10 x 1" Pan head Stainless steel screw. Note that UNDER the Dicor roofing and on the fiberglass material of the M.H.'s side, you need to apply the butyl gummy tape in advance of installing the track. (I marked the center hole with a dimple). OK, when you start inserting the rest of the screws, everything falls neatly into place.

My wife had prepared the original molding, by carefully removing the old butyl gummy tape residue with a 1" scraper. We then tapped out the depressions made in years past when the original screws had been pulled in too tightly by others. We used a 5/8ths" piece of soft wood, to act as backing in the track as we gently hammered the backside down flat by inverting the track and using the male end of a 3/8th's" ratchet 6" extension, as the tool; and a hammer.


The Vertical Edges were actually done on a 2Nd day, not the first. On the 1 st day we concentrated on getting the Horizontal portion of the roof covered and all the bubbles brushed out.
Inside our rented 20' x 40' storage unit, the temperatures in our Florida environment up 15' off the ground and a 5' from the ceiling, would get well over 100 very humid degrees; so I could only take so much of this each day as my sweat dripped like rain and no matter how much I drank gatorade and water, I would get dehydrated by mid afternoon or a bit later!



Vent openings on top, were attended to after the sides were attached.



Those openings, were slit and the material stapled down with stainless steel staples. I applied a small piece of Eternabond tape to the inside corners, but as this should be a dry area is probably not needed, but I did it anyway.



The rolled material that comes with the Dicor Kit, is butyl putty. This gummy grey 1" tape is a gummy material that needs to be applied to ONE surface while still on the paper tape. Once applied to a surface, you can peel of the paper. The butyl tape was applied to the roof after all the holes from the small 2" PVC pipe vents were marked on the rubber roof with a pencil. This way all screw holes will be sealed. The vent was placed into position and #8 x 3/4" pan head s.s. screws used to draw it down into the butyl tape.


Dicor lap sealant(from a 10" tube) seals the screw heads from above, then all was covered with Eternabond 4" tape as an extra measure!



The Refrigeration Vent Cover, was done the same as the other vents. Always, plenty of attention to detail.






The opening for the Air Conditioner, had Extra attention and was built up with an additional layer of material to prevent any standing water from being near the seal. I found a 3.5" x .75" x 96" piece of what I'll call "Plastic wood"/white in color, in Home Depot. I chose to use this, as it will never, never be able to rot. Approximately 14" sections of this were cut and then screwed around the hole/ sealed with dicor lap sealant from tubes/ then covered with the Eternabond tape completely and well! Photos of this probably tomorrow as we prepare to reinstall the A.C. itself.

Roof Rebuild (6/09/09)

Many folks have been following our effort to bring our '91 Class C's cab-over and roof "Up To Date." This doesn't surprise me as most rigs eventually leak here and there and a wise owner will look for information to protect their asset.

In our process, I'm going to stress, even such things as the final cover up of a simple vent pipe, can take time to do well, and therefore, certainly..some fore thought.

New light emitting diode (LED) lights were ordered online and installed to replace the non-working rusted originals.

After all the rebuilding and additions like,the Extra layer of foam, there is still minor yet important details to attend to. Waterproofing just One Simple 1.5" hole, took time..and thought. The hole at first, took a 2" PVC reducing bushing used as an extension to extend up to our new roof level and then sealed with Dicor Rubber roofing, and Dicor Lap Sealant, a layer of Eternabond tape around the fitting, then more lap sealant.

Now that the aft end of the roof is squared off, I will have to cover up the last bit of corner/on the sides, with a triangular or rectangular external piece; well caulked.


Next, came the placement of the Original Plastic support base,to give some support to the uppermost tube. Under the base, we used the Butyl tape to create a seal under it's circumference and the screws. Also, around the external edge, I used a cut strip of Eternabond tape to do the extreme sealant functions after a dab of Dicor lap sealant on the screw heads. Overkill, I'm sure, but why not now rather than even think of repairs later.

We've done our best on each step, and of course have learned.

Hopefully, the pro's do a great job, but I can see many areas for cutting corners. Glad to have done the work myself, and know I could not afford this job if I had to pay for labor too.


In our case, "Sweat Equity" (the use of one's own labor to move forward in life)


We did these Simple things as well as the more difficult, moving on only as fast as the project, or 'life', allowed us to. Too often for us, we were slowed down by this or that, but we wrapped up each task and moved on to the next.

So much of this kind of project is the time needed to Understand what is needed and then Get it. Purchasing items is a hassle most favorably done on the Internet for good pricing, but time is needed too for the 'understanding' of the whole project before one begins and then many runs to H.Depot or a hardware store local supply.


New forward vent installed in front of the A.C. unit should improve airflow.

Now, we have nearly completed the roofing, the 2nd task on this rig; the rebuild of the Cab-Over being the 1st. task.

We need to get this rig Out of the "rented space" in 7 days as we are heading back to our boat in Panama for another 8-10 weeks. When we return, I hope to take a break from working on this rig to taking a trip out west, hopefully to the Grand Canyon. From there, who knows.....maybe leaving it out West for 2 months or so, until we can return again.


Please note, that so far, this site has been a way for us to hopefully pass on some ideas on how to deal with the common degradation that older rigs succumb to...

We also will do some travel. Between fun and work, we will be posting here. Look on the right side of this page to find Work Labels and Fun Labels. Read what turns you on.


A friends of ours recently bought a Mercedes... 24'/Winnebago, only a couple of years old.
THEY LOVE IT!

My wife and I saw a bit of modernization inside, some glitz and visually a bit less space although maybe there were a few cubic feet of storage I could not see. What we did NOT SEE, was "the amount he wrote on his check to the dealer".

I bought our M.H. on Ebay for under 7K. I got a bit taken by a dishonest seller, but "I" knew going into this Ebay thing, that I could rebuild anything if needed. But, with high hopes... that nothing much would be needed, I ended up only half correct.

In the end, I added new tires immediately, then total brakes including drilled/dimpled High Performance after market rotors found online. Bilstein shocks were recommended by everyone so we did that too, Plus a complete tune up including everything like hoses, belts and gaskets.

Now the rebuilding of front cab over and total re-roofing.

Not sure of the all the $ involved, but we now have a clean, safe and dry M.H. at home, with only 32,000 miles on it that we can use for many years to come. We have a very functional/like new traveling home.....at a wonderfully low investment price..Very happy indeed!

(YES, certainly I would have been happier without all the work, but we are still smiling.)

YOU, might NOT be as comfortable as I am or was with this kind of work so be honest with yourself before taking on such a task.
However, IF, you already own a rig that needs work, then I hope this information can help you.

Update May 2010:  Just read an interesting article in Trailer Life magazine on reroofing with PVC material rather than Dicor Rubber.  Looks interesting and similar process.  So maybe check out:
www.ibroof.com
www.suttonrv.com   ........................for some extra info.





Stay well and keep smiling, ron

1000 watt Inverter and 12vdc Batteries plus a 22" TV (8/31/09)

I set up our boat, to run without the need for a generator. The plan there, was to install a large bank of  ' house' batteries to act as a source of power when needed.
 Obviously, we cannot run air conditioning on the boat with battery power and the same is true in our motor home. On the boat, for air conditioning, we need to plug in to 120vac land power. The same is true in our motor home...A.C. requires lots of power, so we need to run the generator or plug in.




OTHER THAN THAT, we can get by with this extra set of Group 29 batteries, wired in parallel, to provide TV, coffee pot computer,or minimum microwave time and lighting. The original 'auxiliary' battery was tied in to these extra two with a cutoff switch.  I usually keep the switch open so charging and discharge affects all 3 as a bank.




Nothing fancy, but installed( 2) Gr.29 deep cycle batteries ($70 ea. @ Walmart) + $7.50/plastic battery box for each. Room was available in a space under the aft dinette seat. An outlet was installed on the forward face of lower section(leg area). The 1000 watt inverter ($100 @ Walmart) is inexpensive as it's a modified square wave unit, not sine wave but works fine for our applications.  It was installed in the small space available just aft of this seat-under the refrigerator. This size is large enough to power our little microwave or coffee pot when needed and not extensively and our T.V. with DVD player/anytime.



A 120 v.a.c. line run was run from the Inverter, forward to the outlet on forward face of aft dinette seat so a short 3' extension cord could be plugged in and allowed to rest near the window on the table, for computer and phone chargers.  Another #12 AC line was led back under refrigerator section to next compartment(hanging locker and drawers), then under the floor in an existing run to the galley cabinets.

From there, up into the overhead microwave cabinet. Double outlets where installed in a box there strictly for plugging in the TV and coffee pot/microwave and amplified RCA TV antenna. An 6 ga. tinned copper wire was run forward and hooked up the the aux. bat. for charging purposes. A time delay fuse installed at the forward/auxilary battery and switch installed between each(actually 'low' on the forward face for the forward dinette seat, where I can just reach down and turn it on or off while I drive, but usually just leave it 'on'.

TV running off the Inverter and Batteries. Recieving about 20 HD channels using an RCA 806 amplified antenna installed in one of the aft overhead cabinets above the bed.



Had a friend of mine make a simple TV mount, that attaches near the roof/on the backside of the galley cabinet, and down on the backspash behind the sink. It is a tube within a tube, so the TV can slide up or down the 1" stainless steel pole(TV 5" x 1/8" flat plate is welded to a 13" piece of 1.25" stainless steel tubing.) The main pole was drilled at 2 points to be able to insert a push pin. This allows the TV to be turned around for viewing in the aft bed and slid up out of the way, completely behind the cabinet.

View looking forward // CLICK ON ANY PHOTO FOR ENLARGED UP CLOSE VIEWING.

For viewing TV while we are forward, we lower the TV and rotate it to face forward, then reinsert the pin. The TV can be left in either position. All works well.

Window Tint (8/31/09)

Added 3 grades of Window Tint to our 24' Class C.


Drivers Side: Before



The driver and passenger windows were done in the street legal tint. I believe that was 25%. (that is the amount of light allowed through the glass to the interior.)

Rear and Passenger Side: Before..Of course we are in Florida now and the sun is intense, but the view available with large windows added too much heat from sunlight.



The middle of the motor home contains the dinning nook window on drivers side and 3 windows, one for the single seat behind the passenger seat, door and slider at the galley. In this mid-section I opted for darker 15% film, to keep the heat down inside but not create an interior that I felt might get too dark.


The last 3 photos show Window Tint Installed.


The aft end windows, as well as the 2 small windows in the "cab over section", were given the darkest film, the 'Limo Tint -- 5% film'.
This is for the large windows beside and behind the double bed and the small window in the head/shower area.


From the outside, all but the driver and passenger widows look black.


After researching the materials, I decided to just hire someone to do the job and I'm glad I took this route. The young gentleman was extremely careful, neat and courteous. He did a wonderful job, was done in about 4.5 hours and charged $250 for materials and labor.

Found him in a Yellow Pages search on Google and also had him do our patio and bedroom doors in the condo.


Aft end is private and not nearly as hot as before... It's still Florida, but now the interior is bearable.



The level of heat intrusion has dropped dramatically, not to mention the added privacy during the day. Close blinds in the evening or when lights are on for privacy.